Olivier Semenoux is Head of Product Management for TCL Europe.In the interview he talks about TCL's European strategy, why Mini LED is better than OLED and when Micro LED will come.The European TV market has a new player: TCL.The Chinese tech company based in Shenzhen, Guangdong, is not well known in this country - TCL is too young for industry standards.TCL's history begins in Hong Kong in 1981, then still under the name TTK.Four years later, the company is sued for manufacturing counterfeit cheap cassettes.TTK then closes its doors, changes its core business and focuses on TVs and other electronic devices under a new name: TCL is born.Measured in terms of televisions sold, TCL is now the second-largest TV manufacturer in the world and is conducting vigorous research into new display technologies.At least that's what Olivier Semenoux, Head of Product Management at TCL Europe and my interview partner says.Olivier, you are the main person responsible for sales of TCL TVs in Europe.How many televisions do you have at home?Five?Six?Olivier Semenoux: No, no (laughs).I don't have that many televisions.I have a large TV in the apartment, ie 65 inches, and a small TV in the bedroom.It's 32 inches tall.Both TCL TVs, of course.Both TCL TVs.Although, I admit, I have a third television set upstairs.It's not from TCL, it's from Philips.Yes, you have to know the competition after all!And yes, isn't it?In fact, Philips was my employer before I joined TCL.Of course we have a lot more TVs in the office.This way we keep a better eye on the competition – literally.What exactly is your job other than keeping an eye on the competition?I'm Head of Product Management.So I monitor the range and define the TV specifications for Europe.For example, whether a specific QLED model «X» should come onto the market with a 50 Hz or 100 Hz image, or whether we want to equip a mini-LED model «Y» with an integrated soundbar.Sounds like a lot of responsibility.Oh yeah.I am also the go-to-market leader.So I'm also responsible for how we communicate our TVs and said specifications to the market and through which channels we do that.On-line.Offline.TV advertising.Online Advertising.Such things.In short: You have to know what kind of TV Luca wants and tell him that you have exactly this TV.How do you do this?On the one hand, we do a lot of market research to better understand our customers.On the other hand, we learn from retailers like you.Your orders indirectly reflect what people want.It is clear that retailers are very important to us.How do you mean?We need retailers to make our brand known in stores.In the branches.Where people get advice.The problem there: Before a salesperson even recommends TCL, he or she first has to know the brand.Not online?Most people look for well-known brands first.One might think.But in fact, our numbers tell us that more TCL TVs are sold online than competing TVs.Ah yes?That surprises me.When people do their own research - which they do online - they don't necessarily prioritize by brand.First they filter by specifications.UHD, HDR, HDMI 2.1 and such.Then they filter by price.Maybe vice versa.Only then, in third place, do customers look at the brand.This is how they come across our televisions.Of course, the pandemic helped because the branches were closed.People couldn't help but do exactly this kind of research online.In the branches, on the other hand, you are dependent on the "goodwill" of the salespeople so that your brand, along with Samsung and Co., is mentioned at all... ...which brings us back to the point of why the retailers and our relationships with them are important to us are that important.For us, this is an obligation.In what way?In the store you have maybe two minutes to convince your customers of a television.You just limit yourself to the brands that are well known and that you don't have to explain to your customers in addition to the television.This saves time and leads to more sales than with an unknown brand.So explaining the brand would be your job as the go-to-market leader.Right.We're not very well known in Europe, we're fully aware of that.If you asked people on the street if they knew TCL as a TV manufacturer, only about 30 percent would say yes.In order to be successful in the Swiss market in the long term, it is therefore essential that we increase brand awareness.And yet TCL is the second largest TV manufacturer in the world.That's because we're among the very strongest TV brands in China and the United States.Makes sense.If you rule the great China, your home market, you rule the world.Nevertheless: Is there a reason why you wanted to gain a foothold in the USA and not in Europe first?Because the US market is not only larger, but also much easier to enter.You have to explain that to me.Look: In the USA, three, maybe four, big retailers determine where the rabbit runs.Amazon and Walmart, to name two.If you have good deals with them, your growth is practically set in stone.And in Europe?In Europe it is much more difficult.First, there are different countries, which in turn have their own small markets with their own rules of the game.Norway doesn't behave like Germany at all.Germany not like Italy, Italy again not like Switzerland.Secondly, you have different legislation in each country and different retailers who set the tone.In Switzerland alone there are more systemically important retailers than in the entire USA.So three or four good deals are not enough to dominate entire countries - let alone all of Europe.And thirdly?Thirdly, there are very different technology standards in Europe.In Switzerland, for example, the Internet is much better and the importance of streaming is therefore much greater than in Greece, for example, where almost everything is transmitted terrestrially.In the US, on the other hand, almost everything is wired.The same laws, labels and standards apply everywhere there.This makes developing the range much easier.So there's a lot of work waiting for you if you want to be as strong as your competition in Europe.That's the way it is.Loyalty is the key here.For example, if you buy a TV from a certain brand, you will probably buy a soundbar from that brand as well.Later maybe even a refrigerator or a vacuum cleaner if you are given a choice in the store.So you also want to sell refrigerators and vacuum cleaners?The truth is that we didn't just come to Europe yesterday.In fact, we've been selling select TCL products for years - just not under the TCL brand.In France, for example, under Thomson.In Italy under De'Longhi.The problem is, no one would connect Thomson and De'Longhi.This is not how you create recognition value for a brand.And certainly no loyalty.So you changed your strategy and now prefer to farm Europe under a single brand.And not only in the TV area.We offer a whole tech ecosystem.washing machines.air conditioners.smart phone.When we gain the trust of our customers in one area, it has a positive effect on the other areas.This is how we kill two birds with one stone: we create brand awareness and promote loyalty.You guys first popped up on my radar when you launched the first TV with mini-LED technology.Great technology.You're talking about the X10.We released it around Christmas 2019.Mini LED means that you have small LEDs on the back of the TV.These shine through the LCD pixels like a projector and generate the image on the glass that you see in front.OLED TVs, on the other hand, are made up of pixels that produce their own light.That's why they don't need an additional LED backlight.However, Mini LED is still a young technology.That's correct.We used to have tubes that created the background light.Later about 20 to 40 small LEDs, on the edge or directly behind the glass.The latter is also called Full Array Local Dimming, i.e. FALD.Now these LEDs just got smaller.Instead of forty, we have thousands of LEDs.Hence the «mini» in «mini LED».The perfect cue for OLED.You said that each OLED pixel produces its own light.With a UHD television, that would be over eight million pixels that switch themselves on and off.Right.The best TVs with FALD backlights have around 500 LEDs by comparison.Back when FALD technology was new, that was a good but not enough first answer to OLED.Mini LED, on the other hand, is not only as good as OLED - Mini LED is better.You have to say that.After all, TCL doesn't sell OLED TVs.Look, OLED is a wonderful technology that has two advantages over the original FALD: no blooming and better black levels.Mini LED, on the other hand, has thousands of LEDs, but still a long way from eight million... ... right, but still a lot more than FALD and therefore more than enough so that there is no visible blooming even with mini LED backlighting.So let's say a tie in terms of blooming.So why is Mini LED still better than OLED?Because of the contrast.This describes the difference between the brightest and the darkest pixel.OLEDs are particularly good because black is really black.Exactly.However, OLEDs do not shine as brightly as the LEDs that provide the background light in LCD televisions.In numbers: Our mini LEDs have a brightness of around 1500 nits.The very best OLEDs, on the other hand, only have about 1000 nits.Mini-LED televisions therefore have a greater difference between light and dark, and therefore, by definition, better contrast values.This in turn affects the whole picture.So also on the color volume and the HDR effect.LG and Sony certainly see things differently.Naturally.They wouldn't be doing their job if they said otherwise.Although: LG has also recently been building mini LED televisions.I'm sure they see the benefits of the technology as much as we do.But you have a head start there.Yes I think so.We are definitely about two years ahead of our competition.We have been working on Mini LED since 2017. We manufacture our Mini LED screens in our own factories.Building in your own factories means being independent.What about the competition: do you also build mini LED panels for them?I can't say that (laughs).If I ask nicely?Let me put it this way: All TV manufacturers have the option of buying the panel – i.e. the screen – somewhere else and then installing it together with the rest of their own hardware.Your own processor or speakers, for example.However, there are currently only three manufacturers who sell mini LED televisions: Samsung, LG and us.And?In our factories we produce a total of about 23 million TVs, but around 40 million panels a year.From here I'll let you add one and one yourself (laughs).So you build more panels than TVs.These panels will hardly stand around anywhere;you sell them.But you haven't told me how many of those 17 million excess panels are actually mini-LED panels.And neither will I.In fact, I don't have detailed insight into what display technology is being sold, in what quantity, at what price, and to which brands anyway.But you have a certain power, that's for sure.Like LG and its OLED panels for TVs.This is true.We can sell the panels ourselves cheaply, which in turn affects the price in the store.In addition, we can control the direction of research and development for future display generations.Which direction would that be?In the X10, our first generation of mini LEDs, we installed mini LEDs that are around 1600 micrometers in size.That's 1.6 millimeters.In the third generation, the OD Zero generation, we have arrived at 152 micron mini LEDs, which is roughly the thickness of two human hairs.So, in the future, the mini LEDs will be even smaller?The smaller the mini LEDs, the more can be installed.This in turn reduces blooming and improves contrast.In addition, with OD Zero, our third mini LED generation, we are at a point where we have reduced the distance between the mini LED backlight and the front glass to zero.Why is this important?Less light path means a brighter image.And the thinner the panel, the easier it is to bend.This opens up new form factors.Does that mean that Mini LED could also be interesting for smartphones?Why not?Most of today's flagship smartphones have an OLED display.This is because LCD displays are still too rigid and immobile to be used for smartphones with curved displays.So we still have to do some work on the thickness of the panel.A Samsung employee recently explained to me that they have removed the dome-like lens that is commonly placed over LEDs.This makes the panels thinner, which - as I learned today - is better for overall brightness.Interesting.The lenses are nothing more than small mini diffusers.They scatter the LED light evenly over the entire screen.While I can't speak for the competition, what I can say is that our latest Mini LEDs are the smallest on the market at 152 microns.Accordingly, it is not necessary to remove the lenses.So you didn't omit the lenses like Samsung did?noI don't know what trick Samsung found so that the individual LEDs are not recognizable as such, even without a diffuser.But we don't need such tricks anyway.Why not?Our Mini LEDs are much smaller.When I said earlier that our new mini LEDs are 152 micrometers in size, I meant that including the diffuser lenses.Samsung's LEDs are probably significantly larger than ours, even without diffuser lenses.you guessWhy not just buy a Neo QLED from Samsung, open it up and measure it?Because as of today there is no Neo QLED to buy.It's correct.Okay, to put it another way: will you buy a Neo QLED, open it and measure it?No comment (laughs).I don't think there is much we can learn from Samsung about Mini LED though.TCL is pretty much ahead of them there.TCL is also a pioneer in this area.Nevertheless, I will definitely buy a Neo QLED to have the benchmark of the competition.Is that the reason why you are much more open about the number of LEDs and dimming zones than the others?We develop and build our own mini LED panels.Others don't.As a result, we know the technology very well and have no trouble explaining it if that's what people want.Others, as I said, not.And anyway, if you're not at the top, then you don't necessarily want to admit it by disclosing your numbers.Well then: How many mini-LEDs and dimming zones does the upcoming OD Zero have?The OD Zero will probably have around 1500 to 2000 dimming zones with 20 mini LEDs each, depending on the size of the display.This ensures the best black levels ever seen on a mini LED TV.But I can't be more specific yet.Which brings me to the question, when will mini-LED black become indistinguishable from OLED black?Good question.The ultimate goal would be to build LEDs so small that you can fit 8 million LEDs like OLED TVs.But that would no longer be Mini LED, but Micro LED.Practically all TV manufacturers are working on this.So micro LED is the future then?Micro LED is a possible scenario for the future.But the technology is currently far too expensive.Sometimes even for business customers.Added to this is the modular design of Micro LED.At the moment it is only suitable for large-format screens.For example for billboards, stadium monitors or in the cinema.When will we see Micro LED for home cinema?What would be a realistic estimate?I think it will be a few more years before Micro LED becomes affordable enough for end consumers.Only then is mass production worthwhile.What does affordable mean to you?10,000 francs per television?5,000 francs?More?Fewer?Referring to Switzerland, I would say that for a newly introduced technology, around 100 francs per inch would be an acceptable upper limit.That's still a lot of money, but within what people here are willing to pay for innovation.A kind of pain threshold.Correctly.This is around 50 to 100 percent above what is considered current premium technology.As soon as the innovation is only about 20 percent more expensive, the entire market will change direction, not just the upper premium segment.I wonder if Micro LED is even necessary.The human eye already has trouble distinguishing between UHD and 8K resolution on a 65-inch screen.Let me convert that to OLED, Mini LED and Micro LED: Could the human eye even distinguish between 20,000, 50,000 and eight million LEDs?That's the point.We do not have a scientific study that proves how many LEDs or dimming zones people can distinguish between mini-LED black and OLED black.But you must have an idea, don't you?Even if this isn't scientific field research: if we go by blind tests that we did with trade fair visitors at past trade fairs, I would say that we're already at the point where mini LEDs and OLEDs produce practically the same good black.I repeat myself: of course you have to say it like that.Of course, but I mean it.OLED manufacturers are always trying to spread the message that, theoretically, Mini LED cannot beat OLED.At least as far as the black level is concerned.But what about practice?Will we still hear it like this when you do sell OLED TVs one day?How do you mean?You are working on a new type of production process that could revolutionize the industry.You're talking about ink-jet print technology.We would use it to "print" quantum dots on a surface, similar to ink on an inkjet printer.This could also be micro or mini LEDs.I see.So far I've only heard about your new ink-jet print process in connection with OLED.Right.In addition to mini and micro LEDs, we also want to develop a third process in which we combine quantum dot technology with OLEDs.With OLEDs, a color filter colors the white radiant OLEDs.OLED in a nutshell.What does Quantum Dot mean then?Quantum dots are tiny nanoparticles.The heavier the particle, the slower it vibrates when light hits it.Depending on the vibration, the particle can therefore radiate in a different color.We call the TVs that have such Quantum Dots QLED TVs.And you now want to link that with the self-illuminating OLEDs?Exactly.Instead of using conventional color filters, we would use nanoparticles to control the color into which the light from the OLEDs would be converted.With this we could combine the best of two worlds: the perfect colors of QLED TVs and the perfect black of OLED TVs.Which brings me back to the original question: what would become of Mini LED and Micro LED then?The new production process could be ready for the market in a year or two.But it would still be very expensive.We're talking about 50,000 francs per television.It will certainly take another two or three years before the prices are acceptable for the mass market.So Mini LED will remain the premium technology for LCD TVs for another five years?Probably yes.And when Micro LEDs or the innovative Quantum Dot OLEDs are there, then Mini LEDs are simply recycled in cheaper models.It remains to be seen what will prevail between Micro LED and Quantum Dot OLED.Olivier, I think I've asked everything there is to ask now.Do you have anything else you want to share with us?We've talked a lot about image quality.However, I would like to add that image quality is only one of four pillars, albeit the most important.The other pillars are sound quality, content and design.For example?For example, we're working with Onkyo to make better, integrated speakers and soundbars that also support the latest technologies like Dolby Atmos.We also work closely with Google to offer the best smart TV system with Android TV and soon Google TV.Finally, we pay a lot of attention to looks, as televisions have now become modern design pieces.Thank you for the interview, Olivier.I thank you.70 people like this articleExperiencing adventures in nature and pushing my limits with sport until my own pulse beats — that is my comfort zone.To compensate, I also enjoy the quiet moments with a good book about dangerous intrigues and sinister regicides.Sometimes I adore film music, for minutes.It probably has something to do with my strong 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